Point, Counterpoint

[stan2reason]

Jonathan Haidt recently submitted an article (http://www.edge.org/3rd_culture/haidt07/haidt07_index.html) on the science of moral psychology to Edge.org. In it he insinuates that the "new atheists" like Dawkins and Harris are off the mark. He goes so far as to say that in some aspects, Dawkins exhibits "hallmarks of standard moral thinking, not scientific thinking."

Sam has responded to Haidt's essay here (http://www.edge.org/discourse/moral_religion.html).

S2R

[phrog]

I just want to make one point, however, that should give contractualists pause: surveys have long shown that religious believers in the United States are happier, healthier, longer-lived, and more generous to charity and to each other than are secular people.

I'd like to see these surveys. I find the stats hard to believe. First off, how does one measure happiness? I meet weekly with a few dozen Atheists for coffee chats and they all seem extremely happy. And healthier? Come on, again among the Freethinkers I know, they pretty much represent a cross section of Americans. Some over weight many fit and trim. In fact I'd dare say a larger percentage of health nuts, vegetarians, bike riders and what have you, than your Average American group. And again with the charities. I can only speak for myself here, but I give a larger percentage of my income to charity than Bill Gates. I donate Blood platelets twice a month and often run into a fellow unbeliever who donates often as well. The god botherers tend to put themselves on a pretty high pedestal.

[stan2reason]

I'd like to see these surveys. I find the stats hard to believe. First off, how does one measure happiness? I meet weekly with a few dozen Atheists for coffee chats and they all seem extremely happy. And healthier? Come on, again among the Freethinkers I know, they pretty much represent a cross section of Americans. Some over weight many fit and trim. In fact I'd dare say a larger percentage of health nuts, vegetarians, bike riders and what have you, than your Average American group. And again with the charities. I can only speak for myself here, but I give a larger percentage of my income to charity than Bill Gates. I donate Blood platelets twice a month and often run into a fellow unbeliever who donates often as well. The god botherers tend to put themselves on a pretty high pedestal.

Agreed. I'm not willing to accept this kind of blanket statement without the "studies" in hand. Without the study available for critique and examination of design it means nothing more than quoting someone from an article in Readers Digest.